John Wooley is an entertainment reporter with the Tulsa World and the host of the weekly radio program, Swing on This. He is the author of several fiction and non-fiction books, screenplays, and documentaries. John is also the proud inductee into three music halls of fame and an expert on Oklahoma music and the Tulsa sound. See more about John’s work and accomplishments at www.johnwooley.com.

By Lori Coggins

I met John Wooley February 20, 2004, at the Tulsa World offices. He took time out of his hectic schedule to talk about his writing and how being an Oklahoman has influenced his work. One of his philosophies is, “If we don’t write about our own scene and take care of our own scene, nobody’s going to do it for us.” Oklahomans, especially those in the Tulsa area, are fortunate to have John Wooley on the job, vigilant as always, promoting “our scene.”

How do you think growing up in Oklahoma influenced your writing?

Growing up anywhere influences your writing. We write about what we know, I think. Most of my novels are set in Oklahoma. There’s one that I did called Dark Within that was a finalist for the Oklahoma book award. I’m a big Steinbeck guy. Steinbeck was so influenced by growing up in the Monterey area by Cannery Row. He had such a sense of community with his characters in Cannery Row and Sweet Thursday and Tortilla Flat. In Dark Within, although I do write horror or fantasy, I tried to take that idea of community and see how it would work in Oklahoma. There are places in a lot of my books that, if you knew Chelsea or you knew Foyil, you would know them, especially in Dark Within. It’s all about community and our little eccentricities around here.

What kind of reactions have you gotten to your Oklahoma settings and Oklahoma characters?

The first book I sold I wrote with Ron Wolfe. It was called Old Fears. We had an editor in New York and she called up one time and said, “Now, these people have guns in their trucks? Just hanging up?” She just didn’t get it. You try to be specific to be universal.

What’s the best way to get to know Oklahoma and its culture through your books?

I’d suggest starting with Dark Within. That’s basically my thinly veiled Wal-Mart analogy. I have a real hard time with tearing up the fabric of a small town. The premise of Dark Within is a man in a box starts showing up on these people’s land and he tells them he’ll pay them $100 a week if he can just stay there. He’s not going to do anything. Of course, he finally starts doing things. It’s the idea of commerciality versus community and that’s my Wal-Mart story. Old Fears, Death’s Door, and Dark Within are all set in Oklahoma.

How do you get ideas for your horror novels?

Here’s the way I always answer that question. Ideas are easy. Execution is hard. You and I could sit here right now and knock out a dozen ideas that would make good novels. But to execute any of those ideas it’s going to take each of us a year. So it’s not the ideas, it’s the execution. We’ve got nothing but ideas. There are ideas everywhere you look. I can’t just write a story to scare somebody. It has to say something I believe.

What are some of your major themes?

In Dark Within technology versus community or the lure of money versus the less easily measured things that you have with community and friendship and a sense of place. Awash in the Blood, my latest novel, is about the light and the dark. It’s about how easy it is to think you’re following the light and end up in the darkness.

Do you know how you’re going to execute your novels right from the beginning?

I have to have a theme first before I can write the book. For instance, one of the ways that Awash in the Blood came out was I’m a Presbyterian. In coming back to the church in the mid-eighties—because I was raised a Baptist like all the rest of us—I started studying the Bible. One of the things that hit me was the great Isaiah verse about the light showing in the darkness and the darkness comprehending it not, which, of course, was prophesying the birth of Jesus. It took me a long time to realize that the darkness couldn’t put out the light, but the light couldn’t extinguish the darkness, either. There was still darkness.

Then I was reading a biography of Steinbeck and ran into one of his letters and he says, “It’s not that the evil thing wins. It never does. It’s that it doesn’t go away.” Those two things helped form the basis of what I wanted to do with a televangelist who becomes a vampire and talks himself into thinking that he’s basically doing the same thing he was doing as an evangelist, which is granting eternal life to his followers. That’s the premise.

Do you write other books besides horror?

Yes. I wrote a book called How to Make It in the Music Business, with Jim Halsey, the music impresario. I’ve edited three collections of pulp magazine stories from the 30’s and 40’s, detective fiction stories, and I’ve done some non-fiction books on horror movies. And then I did a thing for the World on Tulsa’s rock and roll roots. I did a five-part series around the Christmas season last year. I’m looking to turn that into a book. So I write a lot of non-fiction.

Tell us about your screenplays.

I wrote Café Purgatory, which was a one-act play that debuted at Heller Theater in the late 90’s. We made that into a low budget movie that in 1999 won the Crowd Pleaser Award at the Fort Worth Film Festival. It’s about a bunch of people who are in a café waiting to see what happens next because they’ve figured out that they’re all dead. Elvis is in it, but Elvis can’t ever leave the café and they start talking and he’s in his bathrobe and he’s been there for years and years. We had a great guy–an Elvis impersonator–playing Elvis. At one point the young heroine asks Elvis why he can’t go with them to the next place. Elvis says, “I have my fans and they are such great people, but they don’t know I’m dead.” We shot it because a friend came in from California, and he was starting a video business. He wanted a film, and he asked if we had anything we could shoot on one or two sets, do real cheaply, and take it around to festivals. I told him about Café Purgatory. So he and I refurbished it for film.

What about other films, documentaries, and projects?

I did a film called Dan Turner, Hollywood Detective, which was shot here in Tulsa in 1990. It was a made-for-T.V. movie. It debuted in prime time on 200 stations, including WGN. Then it went out on video as a film called The Raven Red Kiss Off, which was not my title. I also wrote a documentary for The Learning Channel called Hauntings Across America. I did that with Christopher and Linda Lewis. They did Dan Turner as well. I did a documentary on western swing music called Still Swingin’ that was shot at Cain’s Ballroom. It had Red Steagall, Asleep at the Wheel, Tracy Byrd, Stonehorse, and some of the old Texas Playboys. It was a pretty popular documentary. I’ve done trading cards; I’ve done comic books–pop culture kind of stuff.

What is your favorite thing to do?

Well, it hasn’t happened yet. My favorite thing would be to write a book that made a great deal of money. I came real close with Old Fears, the first book. We had it optioned with Wes Craven right after he made Nightmare on Elm Street, but it never got made. That would have been a windfall.

How do you balance your time when you’re doing so many different things?

It’s very difficult, and the older you get, the harder it is. I’m almost 55 now. I’ve been here [Tulsa World] since I was 34. It was pretty easy when I was 34 to hang out in honky tonks until 1:00 a.m. and then get up at 6:00 and run. I get up at 6:00 every morning. I walk three miles. I do transcendental meditation as a relaxation, restorative, and recharging technique. And then I usually try to write one to two hours before I come in here. And I hate it. I’m not a morning person at all. My wife is. She loves getting up and says, “Isn’t it great seeing the sun?” And I say, “No, it looks exactly the same going down; it’s just on the other side.”

Do you have any advice for people who are interested in writing?

When I lecture or do seminars, I tell them that there are really just three things to know. If you’re going to write, try to write every day in the same place at the same time. If you’ve got an hour to write, read half an hour and write half an hour. So many people now try to write without reading. That’s like trying to make a movie without ever having seen one. The third thing is a very simple equation: you wear them down or they wear you down.

Which of the musicians that you’ve interviewed is your favorite?

I have people that I’ve gotten close to over the years. The people from Oklahoma that have made it in the music business are really nice people–Garth, Vince Gill, Ronnie Dunn. But there are some that you just connect with. I can’t say that I have a favorite, but I have people I really like, people that I’d do anything for. If they need a little publicity for a project, I’ll drop everything. The only time I’ve ever been in awe of anyone I’ve interviewed–I was close with Johnny Cash–was John Carradine. He came here in 1985 to do Revenge with Christopher and Linda Lewis. They were shooting out on the Okmulgee Beeline, and I got to interview Carradine. I’m a huge fan of the old horror movies. I remember seeing him and growing up with that voice and that half-a-profile look. I just kept stammering and looking at him.

How big a part has newspaper writing played in your overall career as an author?

At one point in your life you start pondering why you’re here. The nearest thing that I can tell is that I’m here to create and to celebrate other people who create. Those are the two things that I think are really important for me to do. You have to be a little creative to celebrate those people, or it would be pretty dull.

You also have a radio show.

It’s called Swing on This, and it’s on every Saturday evening at 7:00 p.m., following Prairie Home Companion. They do streaming, so I’ve heard from Albuquerque, New York, the other side of Oklahoma City. You go on www.kwgs.com. It’s been so liberating. Some of the stuff is pretty strange, but that’s part of the charm.

How did you get started in radio?

One of the things I’m really interested in is music from Oklahoma. Western swing didn’t start here; it started in Ft. Worth, but it grew up here. Years ago, Billy Parker, one of the great Oklahomans, said, “Why don’t you come on the show and we’ll play western swing records?” It was perfect, because Billy played on stage with Bob Wills and Johnnie Lee Wills. He toured with Ernest Tubb. Billy’s still one of my best friends to this day. Then Billy, out of nowhere, says, “If anybody would like to hear a show like this every week, give us a call.” We had something like 80 calls in five minutes. So we started a show called Wooley Wednesday on the old KVOO. We did that for about 12 years. We went through two ownership changes before we were finally brought down by corporate radio. Rich Fisher at KWGS decided to give me a chance with no restrictions. It’s just wonderful. I’m getting emails, letters, phone calls. Kids are listening. They’re telling me that it’s a hit.

How do you choose the music?

It’s basically my collection. Western swing is a niche music. Everybody that’s into it is excited about it. You’re not going to turn western swing on and go do something else. You make an appointment for a western swing program. I just go in there and try to balance the new swing stuff and the old swing stuff every week. I start every show with Bob Wills.

Does music play a role in any of your novels?

The one I’m working on now is very deeply involved with music. The protagonist is a man who tours with a ghost band. As a matter of fact the book is called Ghost Band. A ghost band is a band that is carrying the name of a dead bandleader, like the Tommy Dorsey Orchestra. It’s told in the first person from the viewpoint of one of these musicians, who all of a sudden turns around and he’s middle-aged. He thought he was going to do this ghost band for a while, and then he starts seeing real ghosts. It’s all about music.

How do you feel about being the first writer to be inducted into the Oklahoma Music Hall of Fame?

I was stunned. There are so many people who should have gone in ahead of me. I asked them, “Does this mean you want me to quit?” because I got inducted into three halls of fame this year.

What are the other two?

Ft. Worth–The Cow Town Society of Western Music inducted me. Then the Kansas Western Swing Society inducted me. Obviously it made me feel great. My mother is 87. She was able to go see it.

What’s been your mother’s response to all this acclaim?

Maybe now she doesn’t think probably it would be better if I’d become a lawyer.